Well, no need to double-dip there, that's for sure. CC looks great, slightly better, but in motion inconsequential. Thanks BFI.kinjitsu wrote:Gary's comparison
385 Army of Shadows
- Kinsayder
- Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2005 6:22 pm
- Location: UK
As David's Oz caps show (and Gary's scaled-down BFI caps conceal) you get 20% more vertical detail in the PAL - which really does make a difference when viewing on a PAL-native projector.
There are some films that I'm just glad to own in any form whatsoever. Renoir's Nuit du carrefour and Grémillon's Petite Lise are just two examples, a pair of mouldy old boots that I treasure more than any of my Criterions or BFIs. But if rival publishers are thrusting different editions of the same film at us, I think it's reasonable to be picky about which one we spend our money on.triodelover wrote:It's a double-edged sword. The digital revolution has enabled us to have in our possession the Fantomas series in a watchable condition despite approaching 100 years of age. But it also seems that digital play back, whether through flat-panel screens or chip-based projectors, has brought dissatisfaction with what's available and engendered a search for a "holier" grail, for lack of a better term.
- colinr0380
- Joined: Mon Nov 08, 2004 4:30 pm
- Location: Chapel-en-le-Frith, Derbyshire, UK
- souvenir
- Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 12:20 pm
Both the original French trailer and the Rialto trailer are actually on the first disc, though I didn't see it mentioned on the case. Interestingly, in the French trailer, Melville's blue hues are much more muted than on the DVD. I'd be curious to know if the blues were muted only in the trailer, maybe at the behest of the studio, or if the blue tint was also less prominent in the original theatrical prints.Jeff wrote:It seems strange that they wouldn't be able to at least include the Rialto trailer.Narshty wrote:Specs have been updated and "More!" has become "Less!" (no trailers any more - everything else the same).
- tryavna
- Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2005 4:38 pm
- Location: North Carolina
I just finished the Ginette Vincendeau commentary last night and found it remarkably thoughtful and interesting -- probably the best commentary I've listened to since Stephan Prince's for Yojimbo.
One obvious nit-pick, though: She misidentifies the song that plays in the London club as Glenn Miller's "In the Mood." It is, of course, Benny Goodman's "Stompin' at the Savoy." I'm surprised that nobody at either the BFI or Criterion caught the mistake, but I guess it just supports my long-held belief that most academics don't know shit about music.
One obvious nit-pick, though: She misidentifies the song that plays in the London club as Glenn Miller's "In the Mood." It is, of course, Benny Goodman's "Stompin' at the Savoy." I'm surprised that nobody at either the BFI or Criterion caught the mistake, but I guess it just supports my long-held belief that most academics don't know shit about music.
- tryavna
- Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2005 4:38 pm
- Location: North Carolina
True, and I don't mean to suggest that it's a critical flaw in her commentary. However, the fact that "Stompin' at the Savoy" is a song explicitly about dancing would have driven her point home. (Not to mention that Goodman has always been more highly respected by French artists and intellectuals like Melville than Miller.)Kinsayder wrote:But I guess the basic point, about American culture as resistance to oppression, is still the same whether it's Glenn Miller or Benny Goodman.
Still, it's just an example of sloppy research. How hard would it have been for her to confirm her assumption by actually listening to "In the Mood"? Despite a few superficial similarities, the songs sound nothing alike.
- Jeff
- Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 9:49 pm
- Location: Denver, CO
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
This is currently available in HD for free from Comcast On Demand. The bottom of the subtitles are cut off on my television, rendering a rather unpleasant viewing experience, but perhaps this is an indication that a Blu-ray is on the way.
- wiljan
- Joined: Mon Jun 19, 2006 6:13 am
- Location: Rotterdam
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
I'm not sure about international releases, but it certainly had a Dutch HDDVD release and I picked it up for a couple of euros at a local video store when HDDVD was declared a dead format. Still haven't gotten around to watching it though, as I had just seen the Criterion release, so I can't comment on the quality.david hare wrote:This title was announced as ready and coming for HDDVD in the early days of that now dead format but never made it, and then of course the format war ended.
- dad1153
- Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2009 10:32 am
- Location: New York, NY
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
Rewatched "Army of Shadows" last week during it's Sundance Channel premiere. From that impressive re-enactment of World War II Nazi storm troopers marching through Champs Elysees (why would Melville even think of placing it at the end eludes me) to it's stunning but completely appropriate conclusion (my father also watched the movie in another state at my suggestion and the ending blew him away) "Army of Shadows" tells its story with all the nuanced know-how of someone that was there to witness and live these events first-hand. Since he's also a gifted storyteller Melville employs the techniques of his trade to go beyond memories, anecdotes and romanticized notions of what members of an armed resistance would go through. All the lead characters (composites of real-life Resistance figures) are heroic and stoic but also flawed and prone to mistakes or overconfidence, just as regular people thrown into extraordinary situations would be. Lino Ventura, Simone Signoret or Paul Meurisse take turns stealing the movie from each other (or complement their peers) with excellent performances. Ventura is particularly strong and carries most of the movie's screen time. Even when Melville strikes out (those miniature airplanes for a nighttime parachute drop scene; the 'running away from the machine-gun fire' escape, etc.) you forgive him because there's a Spielberg-type exuberance in seeing him trying out this type of stuff back in '68. I even liked the Charles de Gaulle lookalike scene precisely because it flips a bird to the then-prevalent political correctness in French society of how to portray de Gaulle in popular culture.
Criterion's 2nd bonus disc in the "Army of Shadows" package (which I saw a while back) is like a miniaturized crash course in French Resistance history that helps one appreciate and put the movie in proper perspective. Loved the B&W TV interview in which former Resistance leaders are arguing about decades-old grievances while Melville's bald head sits between them casually listening and turning back to look at the camera (and us! 8-)).
Criterion's 2nd bonus disc in the "Army of Shadows" package (which I saw a while back) is like a miniaturized crash course in French Resistance history that helps one appreciate and put the movie in proper perspective. Loved the B&W TV interview in which former Resistance leaders are arguing about decades-old grievances while Melville's bald head sits between them casually listening and turning back to look at the camera (and us! 8-)).
- Le Samouraï
- Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 6:51 am
- Location: Denmark
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
Was this ever released in a digipak or just in a regular keepcase?
- arsonfilms
- Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:53 pm
- Location: Philadelphia, PA
- Contact:
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
It's always been a keepcase.Le Samouraï wrote:Was this ever released in a digipak or just in a regular keepcase?
- swo17
- Bloodthirsty Butcher
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:25 am
- Location: SLC, UT
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
Now it's being released in a Blu-ray case.
- HistoryProf
- Joined: Mon Mar 13, 2006 3:48 am
- Location: KCK
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
I wonder if they'll start lowering the prices of 2 discers like this one now that they are on Blu ray - or if that will only apply to future releases.
- zedz
- Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2004 7:24 pm
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
Those of us who remember the good old days of the full-price, bare bones, non-anamorphic High and Low have an idea. (Actually, are those bare bones Leans still $39.95?)
- Napier
- Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 9:48 am
- Location: The Shire
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
Ah, the good old days. And yes, those Leans are still $39.95. I've actually come to grips with the fact that 90% of the Criterion catalog will be upgraded. I have yet to have a problem actually selling the SD DVDs. Someone even bought my non-anamorphic Charade just last week, from this very forum.zedz wrote:Those of us who remember the good old days of the full-price, bare bones, non-anamorphic High and Low have an idea. (Actually, are those bare bones Leans still $39.95?)
- HistoryProf
- Joined: Mon Mar 13, 2006 3:48 am
- Location: KCK
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
Well the Blob was reduced to $29.95 without an upgrade...so who knows what their plans are. They are the only dvd company in the U.S. that has never lowered the price of their DVDs though. they should do it after 5 years at the least. At some point they aren't doing themselves any favors by keeping boxes of General Idi Amin Dada in the warehouse. drop em to $19.95 and watch them fly!
- movielocke
- Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2008 12:44 am
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
that may have to do with print runs, the price change. They say that dvd replicating costs have fallen, so if they're out of dvds and have print a new run they may as well price them similarly. perhaps that will happen with other catalog dvds that they run out of stock on.HistoryProf wrote:Well the Blob was reduced to $29.95 without an upgrade...so who knows what their plans are. They are the only dvd company in the U.S. that has never lowered the price of their DVDs though. they should do it after 5 years at the least. At some point they aren't doing themselves any favors by keeping boxes of General Idi Amin Dada in the warehouse. drop em to $19.95 and watch them fly!
- MitchPerrywinkle
- Joined: Thu Sep 16, 2010 1:26 am
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
I'm really glad to hear this is coming out on Blu-ray. I watched about a good half of it (never got around to finishing it, sadly), but what I saw was electrifying and haunting. I was amazed at just how new this film looks. It could have been made last week.
Either way, I find that this is as good an excuse as any to finish it come January.
Either way, I find that this is as good an excuse as any to finish it come January.
- daniel p
- Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 9:01 pm
- Location: Melbourne, Australia
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
One that I have most been waiting for on Blu-ray, can't wait to revisit in HD!
So is this the only Melville that Studio Canal didn't 'snatch away'? I know Le Cercle Rouge and Bob Le Flambour, but how about Le Samourai? Is that still a possibility for Criterion Blu?
So is this the only Melville that Studio Canal didn't 'snatch away'? I know Le Cercle Rouge and Bob Le Flambour, but how about Le Samourai? Is that still a possibility for Criterion Blu?
- knives
- Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 6:49 pm
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
Le Samurai and Le Deuxieme Souffle are from Editions Rene Chateau, not SC. Army of Shadows is still a bit of a question mark, though. It's officially licensed via Rialto (and this Blu does suggest that things are out of SC's hands), but several others fit that same situation. Some one with the DVD might be able to read the fine print.
- Brian C
- I hate to be That Pedantic Guy but...
- Joined: Wed Sep 16, 2009 11:58 am
- Location: Chicago, IL
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
While it is licensed from Rialto, the copright is attributed to "StudioCanal Image/Fono Roma (Italie)", and there's a StudioCanal logo stamped on the bottom. It's unquestionably an SC-held title.
I can only assume that Rialto's license extends far enough into the future that Criterion decided a BD release was worthwhile. Regardless of the reason, though, I didn't think it would happen and perhaps because of that, I'm irrationally thrilled to see it given an upgrade. This is one of my very favorite films, and as terrific as the Criterion DVD is, I'm more than happy to double-dip.
I can only assume that Rialto's license extends far enough into the future that Criterion decided a BD release was worthwhile. Regardless of the reason, though, I didn't think it would happen and perhaps because of that, I'm irrationally thrilled to see it given an upgrade. This is one of my very favorite films, and as terrific as the Criterion DVD is, I'm more than happy to double-dip.
- captveg
- Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2009 7:28 pm
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
Ditto. That simply has to be the situation with the licensing.Brian C wrote:While it is licensed from Rialto, the copright is attributed to "StudioCanal Image/Fono Roma (Italie)", and there's a StudioCanal logo stamped on the bottom. It's unquestionably an SC-held title.
I can only assume that Rialto's license extends far enough into the future that Criterion decided a BD release was worthwhile.
- Adam X
- Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2009 5:04 am
Re: 385 Army of Shadows
and damnit, of course I only just bought the DVD. curse my need to remove the shrink wrap when getting it in the mail - I could've just returned it!
ah well, if they release Crash on BD, all will be forgiven...
ah well, if they release Crash on BD, all will be forgiven...