Criterion and UHD

The scuttlebutt on Criterion, Eclipse, and Janus Films. Lists and polls are STRONGLY discouraged.
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Calvin
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2011 11:12 am

Re: Criterion and UHD

#251 Post by Calvin » Sun Dec 01, 2019 12:51 pm

Synapse's Suspiria might provide them with a better measure. Any word on how that one is selling?

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EddieLarkin
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2012 10:25 am

Re: Criterion and UHD

#252 Post by EddieLarkin » Sun Dec 01, 2019 1:45 pm

Suspiria has an even higher retail price ($60 vs. Tammy's $50), but we are not comparing like for like. The Tammy UHD is currently available only in its Limited Edition 3D Slipcover form, and only through the VS webstore. Eventually VS will release a standard UHD with no slipcover, available from everywhere. Suspiria on the otherhand is already available in its only planned (non-LE) edition, and is thus already available everywhere. I imagine VS are only going to judge the success of this release on UHD once the standard edition is available.

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tenia
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Re: Criterion and UHD

#253 Post by tenia » Sun Dec 01, 2019 3:28 pm

Synpase might get burnt with Suspiria though as they've been repeatedly saying over the past years "we don't plan this or that" only to later release those.
I wouldn't be surprised Suspiria gets a non-LE UHD re-release in the near future, or at least that some customers will be waiting for one instead of buying the current LE release (which also doesnt even include the movie on BD despite its price).

In any case, you're right about the probable wait for slightly longer term figures to assess the market.

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Luke M
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2007 9:21 pm

Re: Criterion and UHD

#254 Post by Luke M » Sun Dec 01, 2019 3:50 pm

Luke M wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 11:23 am
VS's website shows they have 459 in stock of the 4K version but only 40 of the regular blu-ray. I would've thought more people would've went for the 4K but I imagine the adoption just isn't there yet.
Tammy and the T-Rex now showing 246 left of the 4K and 216 of the blu-ray. Seems they moved about 200 slipcovers?

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dwk
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2010 6:10 pm

Re: Criterion and UHD

#255 Post by dwk » Sun Dec 01, 2019 4:35 pm

tenia wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 3:28 pm
Synpase might get burnt with Suspiria though as they've been repeatedly saying over the past years "we don't plan this or that" only to later release those.
I wouldn't be surprised Suspiria gets a non-LE UHD re-release in the near future, or at least that some customers will be waiting for one instead of buying the current LE release (which also doesnt even include the movie on BD despite its price).

In any case, you're right about the probable wait for slightly longer term figures to assess the market.
Synapse's Suspiria UHD isn't a limited edition. And, despite the high MSRP, I think it is like $35 or $36 at most etailers. A price that I think is more than fair.

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tenia
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Re: Criterion and UHD

#256 Post by tenia » Sun Dec 01, 2019 5:37 pm

dwk wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 4:35 pm
Synapse's Suspiria UHD isn't a limited edition.
Oh, right, my bad. :oops:
dwk wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 4:35 pm
And, despite the high MSRP, I think it is like $35 or $36 at most etailers. A price that I think is more than fair.
It's way more expensive than what most people are paying for the utmost majority of their BDs and again, despite that, it's not even a combo.


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HitchcockLang
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Re: Criterion and UHD

#258 Post by HitchcockLang » Wed Dec 11, 2019 10:14 am

This is a bit of a tangential question but have any non-English language movies been released on UHD in North America by any label at this time?

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Luke M
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2007 9:21 pm

Re: Criterion and UHD

#259 Post by Luke M » Wed Dec 11, 2019 10:18 am

HitchcockLang wrote:This is a bit of a tangential question but have any non-English language movies been released on UHD in North America by any label at this time?
Well Go released Zhang Yimou's Shadow

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DeprongMori
Joined: Fri Apr 04, 2014 1:59 am
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Re: Criterion and UHD

#260 Post by DeprongMori » Wed Dec 11, 2019 10:42 am

HitchcockLang wrote:
Wed Dec 11, 2019 10:14 am
This is a bit of a tangential question but have any non-English language movies been released on UHD in North America by any label at this time?
Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon in 2016.

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TMDaines
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:01 pm
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Re: Criterion and UHD

#261 Post by TMDaines » Tue Dec 17, 2019 10:21 am

Exciting...

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RitrovataBlue
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2019 4:02 pm

Re: Criterion and UHD

#262 Post by RitrovataBlue » Tue Dec 17, 2019 10:38 am

Pan’s Labyrinth recently got a 4K release from Universal. I haven’t watched it to compare with the Criterion, but most of my UHD experiences to date have been vastly superior to their Blu-ray equivalents. With Easy Rider coming soon, there will soon be two films in the collection with UHD releases in the US. I wonder how many more there will be by the end of 2020.

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TwoTecs
Joined: Fri Mar 10, 2017 10:26 pm

Re: Criterion and UHD

#263 Post by TwoTecs » Tue Dec 17, 2019 11:54 am

RitrovataBlue wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 10:38 am
Pan’s Labyrinth recently got a 4K release from Universal. I haven’t watched it to compare with the Criterion, but most of my UHD experiences to date have been vastly superior to their Blu-ray equivalents. With Easy Rider coming soon, there will soon be two films in the collection with UHD releases in the US. I wonder how many more there will be by the end of 2020.
Age of Innocence was one of the titles mentioned in the Sony UHD survey earlier this year. Probably not a lot of people voted for it but I really hope it comes to UHD.

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dwk
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2010 6:10 pm

Re: Criterion and UHD

#264 Post by dwk » Tue Dec 17, 2019 12:24 pm

TMDaines wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 10:21 am
Exciting...
What is "Exciting"?


kekid
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 9:55 pm

Re: Forthcoming: Parasite & Memories of Murder

#266 Post by kekid » Wed Apr 22, 2020 5:16 pm

I asked Jon Mulvaney as to whether Parasite issue will include a 4K version. He was very prompt and detailed in his response. Part of it I post below:

"We understand that there's interest from the Blu-Ray collectors community for this format and it's something that our team has continued to discuss regularly, but PARASITE will not be a 4K UHD title for us at this time (nor is it currently due to be released in Region B format). It will be released on Blu-Ray (Region A) and DVD (Region 1). The full details of the release will be available as soon as it's officially announced, so keep an eye on this page for updates: I'm confident most fans will be pleased with the final version of this addition to the Collection, even though it's not 4K.

While there's more to our reasoning than this, I found the interview our technical director recently did with Home Theater Forum Podcast fairly insightful on the topic of 4K (the question comes up about 16 minutes into the episode.)"

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DeprongMori
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Re: Forthcoming: Parasite & Memories of Murder

#267 Post by DeprongMori » Wed Apr 22, 2020 8:26 pm

Here is the HTF Podcast interview with Criterion’s Lee Kline, where he discusses the 4K question, from last July.

My disappointment with his answer was that he focussed on “well, what are people watching the films on?” While legitimate at some level, with the rapid improvement in technology one wants to invest in media now that will show well as the displays become more accessible. I’ve been buying 4K UHD whenever possible — even though I don’t have the hardware — because I know I will upgrade my hardware later — and I want to support companies now who are doing the work in making the 4K UHD media available.

bluesforyou
Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2020 6:35 am

Re: Forthcoming: Parasite & Memories of Murder

#268 Post by bluesforyou » Thu Apr 23, 2020 12:30 am

Unbelievable that they still keep referring people to that interview even when Parasite is getting a UHD.

Kline himself says he is not in charge of the decision making regarding formats. And the whole bit about how you can't see 4K on smaller screens is absurd. And even if smaller screens didn't benefit from the resolution bump (I have a 55 in TV and the difference is easily very noticeable) 4K has a lot to offer in terms of color and dynamic range (it would also help Criterion with their compression issues). At the end of that segment he even recommends that people buy Apocalypse Now on UHD.

What are we even supposed to take away from this? Films like Don't Look Now, Crash, Ran, The Elephant Man, Parasite (BP winner but still a foreign language film), and The Burning are getting UHDs. Many boutique labels are testing the waters and yet the most prestigious label gives bad excuses.

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tenia
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Re: Forthcoming: Parasite & Memories of Murder

#269 Post by tenia » Thu Apr 23, 2020 2:36 am

UHDs can be poorly encoded too. Studio Canal and Capelight for instance have recurring issues there. So UHD wouldn't help Criterion with their encodes, it would be another thing their authoring houses might be sub-par with. Especially as it would all be sourced from 4K materials, THE stuff they can't encode without issues on BD already.

But again, as usual : the issue with UHD sales is that they're not BD sales in market shares. A market that has plummetted on top of that so this smaller MS% is of a total market that has massively shrunk.
And even if it seems to be very different for catalogue labels, people should realise it might never be viable for Criterion to release stuff on UHD. Ever.

bluesforyou
Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2020 6:35 am

Re: Forthcoming: Parasite & Memories of Murder

#270 Post by bluesforyou » Thu Apr 23, 2020 6:10 am

Encoding has generally improved with UHD. Look at something like the Apocalypse Now release where the same authoring house produced a terrible BD and a gorgeous UHD. Ofcourse anything can be screwed up but UHDs give you more headroom.

I don't think people expect boutique labels will have constant stream of UHDs like big Hollywood and European distributors. They just want to see more popular titles get the 4K treatment. Like I said even boutique labels that don't have Criterion's visibility and prestige are putting out UHDs just to test waters so I don't think it is impossible for Criterion to release one.

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EddieLarkin
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2012 10:25 am

Re: Forthcoming: Parasite & Memories of Murder

#271 Post by EddieLarkin » Thu Apr 23, 2020 6:13 am

tenia wrote:
Thu Apr 23, 2020 2:36 am
UHDs can be poorly encoded too. Studio Canal and Capelight for instance have recurring issues there. So UHD wouldn't help Criterion with their encodes, it would be another thing their authoring houses might be sub-par with. Especially as it would all be sourced from 4K materials, THE stuff they can't encode without issues on BD already.
Actually, the authoring house Criterion use (Radius60) have proven quite adept at encoding UHDs, despite them regularly doing a poor job with BDs. They did Apocalypse Now for instance, which was terribly encoded on the new BD, but completely issue free on the UHD, despite being done for the same package.

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tenia
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Re: Forthcoming: Parasite & Memories of Murder

#272 Post by tenia » Thu Apr 23, 2020 8:28 am

Criterion are actually mostly going through Pixelogic now.
I had no idea Radius60 did AN's UHD. Did they also do the BD ? It... would make sense (sadly) considering how it looks but I don't think it'd be unheard of the UHD and the BD being encoded by 2 different entities.
Thid is good to know however they can encode UHDs that well. That's one more authoring house doing things good, which is always a good thing.

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dwk
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2010 6:10 pm

Re: Forthcoming: Parasite & Memories of Murder

#273 Post by dwk » Thu Apr 23, 2020 10:35 am

In 2016 Pixelogic bought Radius60.

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swo17
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:25 am
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Re: Forthcoming: Parasite & Memories of Murder

#274 Post by swo17 » Thu Apr 23, 2020 10:39 am

bluesforyou wrote:
Thu Apr 23, 2020 6:10 am
I don't think people expect boutique labels will have constant stream of UHDs like big Hollywood and European distributors. They just want to see more popular titles get the 4K treatment.
That's not the lesson Criterion learned from Blu-ray

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EddieLarkin
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2012 10:25 am

Re: Forthcoming: Parasite & Memories of Murder

#275 Post by EddieLarkin » Thu Apr 23, 2020 11:02 am

tenia wrote:
Thu Apr 23, 2020 8:28 am
Criterion are actually mostly going through Pixelogic now.
I had no idea Radius60 did AN's UHD. Did they also do the BD ? It... would make sense (sadly) considering how it looks but I don't think it'd be unheard of the UHD and the BD being encoded by 2 different entities.
Thid is good to know however they can encode UHDs that well. That's one more authoring house doing things good, which is always a good thing.
Yes, as far as I know they did the whole package for Lionsgate.

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